Tell me about it.
Because, based on my off-the-cuff estimates from scrounging around the intertubes yesterday and today, I can reload birdshot rounds for about half the price as new-off-the-shelf ones (so long as I get the components on sale / cheaply), which means this little press
So, is that press sufficient to get the job done? What about buckshot reloading? What about slugs? Are those two economically feasible, or is it just cheaper to buy loaded rounds? Is that press sufficient for basic reloading demands, or should I move up to something along these lines?
One thing is for certain – the Saiga eats shells like candy, especially with 20-round drums or 12-round sticks attached to it, and I was going to get into reloading at some point, so it might as well be now; ammunition prices certainly are not going down!
The Lee press is pretty flimsy compared to the MEC and they are inconvenient if you plan on using multiple shot sizes or multiple powders. I have several of the MEC presses that my dad bought in the 80s and they are still going strong.
What P. Allen said.
The Lee is fairly flimsy. If you are planning on loading shotshells in numbers like you would pistol rounds then I’d go with the MEC just for the durability issue.
As he also said – inconvenient for multiple shot or powders. But also cheap enough to buy multiple Lee loaders and have them each set up for those multiple shot sizes or powders. That’s a call you’d have to make.
One more thing, sometimes reloaded shells don’t always crimp down like a factory shell and that may create feeding issues in a Saiga. You may want to investigate that prior to dumping a bunch of cash into a bunch of gear.
Oh, and this may be a better price depending on shipping costs.
https://fsreloading.com/lee-12g-load-all-ii-90011.html
@ P. Allen: Hm. Flimsy is bad, but I plan on finding one particular loading and running with that in general – I do not hunt and I do not compete, this is just a cost-saving endeavor.
@ GuardDuck: Hm. Will have to look into the issues regarding reloading for the Saiga… The rounds a friend of Oleg’s brought to the shoot worked just fine, but I neglected to ask what system he used.
And, yeah, there are sources even cheaper than that, I was just making the quick-and-dirty link
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I am surprised that you can save money loading 12-gauge shells.
When I looked at the equation, commercial ammunition (in #7 or #8 shot) was about half the cost of reloading. I was leaning to a Dillon SL-900 (being VERY happy with the 650s that I have, and the 1050 that I use occasionally).
I decided it was silly to spend AUD$1000, burn private time reloading, and pay MORE for ammunition.
I am also quite surprised that you can save money there. I know it is feasible to reload slugs here in Germany, but of course only if you cast the bullet yourself. But buckshot and birdshot would be way more expensive – have you considered all components you need? Remembered the wads, which I tend to forget about usually?
If you feel the need, or desire to load steel shot, look up the price for steel ball bearings, I remember somebody finding cheaper prices because they were targeted to industry, rather than shooters.
I’ve officially run my Lee Pro1000 press into the ground with only about 10,000 rounds loaded.
Their single-stage and turret presses seem simple enough for them to not screw up…anything complicated, I’d spend a little more money…because I’m going to have to do that now, and wish I had done it in the first place.
Oh and BTW I started reloading with just what I read on the internet and the few books that came with my press and the load manuals I bought.
And that was before youtube. So if you think its a good idea, I’d dive into it.
Still when you think of the payload, I’m always amazed at how cheap 12ga is, so make sure you do careful math.
@ Sendarius: Well, here is the rough run-down, as best I can reconstruct it:
(All reloading component prices are from Widener’s, though most of the items I quote are out of stock, and prices will probably go up when they are back in stock.)
We start with the assumption that I already have empty hulls on-hand from previous store-bought loaded ammunition.
Winchester shotshell primers are $36.75 per 1000, or $0.03675 a round.
Hodgdon “Clays Universal” powder (just to pull a name and type out of a hat, though that particular one is used for shotgun loads) is $110.50 per 8lb cannister. Assume a load of 20 grains per round (just a middle-of-the-road number), and given that there are 7000 grains per pound, that works out to $0.03946 per round.
Winchester wads are $99 per 5000, or $0.0198 per round.
And Star Shot #4 shot is $24.50 per 25lb bag. Assume 1.125 ouce loads (because I am a glutton for punishment, after all), and that works out to $0.06891 a round.
Sum all that up, and you get $0.1649 per round.
The cheapest I could find a similar loading online (and if you can find cheaper, I would love to hear about it
) is 250 rounds for $54.95, or $0.2198 a round.
Ok, so “half the price” was a bit optimistic – I must have been running other numbers – but that off-the-shelf stuff is on sale, and its usual price is around $0.26 a round, so at least that was closer.
This is all without counting what your time is worth – that is a matter for you to decide – but it is also not counting the value of being able to try out different loads, or fine-tune something for your particular platform (something that may prove useful for a temperamental Saiga SBS). Plus there is the possibility of engineering my own “Sound and Fury” rounds, which, out of an 8″ barrel, would just be awesome.
In any case, something tells me there are some substantial price idfferences between American reloading components and Aussie ones
.
@ Tierlieb: Now casting is definitely not something I am going to get into. Way too many opportunities to creatively hurt myself!
@ Weer’d Beard: It vaguely amuses me that ball bearings – which I assume would have to have tighter tolerances than steel shot – are cheaper. Wierd.
Shot is definitely the expensive part, but if you buy it in large enough quantities, it is not too bad, relatively speaking. And, yeah, given the amount of lead going downrange, it is stupid-cheap compared to shaped and jacketed bullets.
Anywise, that whole “Big BOOM” round concept is definitely tempting my easily-amused inner child.
@ Weer’d Beard:
Wouldn’t ball bearings be harder than you’d want? I suppose the shot cup should protect the bore, but isn’t most steel shot made as soft as possible?
Actually, casting isn’t that risky compared to things like base-jumping or rioting. I’ve done small-scale casting in the past, & managed not to plate any fingers. I would recommend only casting in a well-ventilated area; outside is best.
A casual check of Midway’s site turned up multiple-cavity buckshot molds, but only single-cavity slug molds.
Lee Precision sells a couple of slug moulds that work well. Their loader is adequate for a starter rig. The touchy part with shotshells is the crimp. A gentle warming of the crimp area with a hair dryer may be helpful. Some trap ranges “mine” the fall area and sell the reclaimed shot. Slug and buck loading disrupts the normal cycle of the press, IMHO those shells should be treated like metallic cartridges, working out of a loading block. In case of the slightest doubt, check weigh the whole batch of shells.
@ Beaumont: You do not exactly see me doing those kinds of things either
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Maybe one day, once I have had a chance to try reloading in general, but I just remembered that I have nowhere closer than an hour+ away to test/pattern my shotgun shells, so something tells me I will not be getting into this any time soon.
@ Ritchie: A good scale does seem to be the cornerstone of any reloading rig.